tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6621561.post8392062259246228913..comments2023-11-03T05:56:36.182-07:00Comments on ConceptDev (Craig Dunn's blog): MIX 10k ChallengeCraig Dunnhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09377896535933926653noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6621561.post-53846804195292122402008-12-27T20:38:00.000-08:002008-12-27T20:38:00.000-08:00Similar sentiments were posted here. Adam's respon...Similar sentiments were <A HREF="http://www.bluerosegames.com/SilverlightBrassTacks/post/Thoughts-on-the-MIX-10K-challenge.aspx" REL="nofollow">posted here</A>. <A HREF="http://adamkinney.com/" REL="nofollow">Adam's</A> response was <I>We went with counting the source code for a few reasons, ... due to the fact we're supporting different technologies... the contest was inspired by Butterfield's 5k contest, where the focus was on the code written and resources used, not the HTML or JavaScript engine.<BR/>Admittedly this is our first attempt at a contest like this and we're keeping notes.</I><BR/><BR/>It's fair enough to say "this is like Butterfields" - they got their inspiration and ran with it. I'm sure they realised they couldn't please everyone...<BR/><BR/>HOWEVER, it still seems weird for a <B>Microsoft</B> competition. He says <I>because...we're supporting different technologies</I> -- Silverlight/XBAP/ClickOnce may have some major differences I'm not aware of -- but they're all fundamentally CLR/IL, right? There isn't a better metric than source-size?<BR/><BR/>Every time I was forced to use some verbose Xaml element/attribute I cringed - Xaml really isn't well suited to size-limitation. Ditto for some of the framework classes. And I've got NO idea how you'd go saving whitespace in Visual Basic source - disincenting VB devs isn't very 'Microsoft', is it?<BR/><BR/>I do see their point about not using "download size" though - my final assembly is 23k; but the XAP is 250k because I need System.Xml.Linq .Serialization and .Utils which need to be packaged up and downloaded. You'd need more explicit rules to say which Microsoft-supplied assemblies are allowed and which aren't (not to mention how limited the Silverlight applications<BR/> functionality would be).<BR/><BR/>It will be interesting once all the entries are in to see what the average 'final assembly' size is... perhaps a 2^15 (32,768<I>bytes</I>) Silverlight assembly would be a good benchmark (based on more features than my 23k assembly, and picking a power-of-two for good measure - 16k would be too small I think).<BR/><BR/>If I get a chance I might 'port' my entry to XBAP and ClickOnce just to see how they differ in source, assembly and final download size...Craig Dunnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09377896535933926653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6621561.post-58032110699422370032008-12-27T19:56:00.000-08:002008-12-27T19:56:00.000-08:00One thing I don't understand about this competitio...One thing I don't understand about this competition is why the 10K challenge has to be measured by source code and not the compiled and compressed code.<BR/>It forces people to make ugly code, and it doesn't really matter to the end user how much code there was, only how big the download is.<BR/>There are so many other things you can tweak on, like using xaml instead of images, using better zip compression, ensure you have fewer IL statements etc.Morten Nielsenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00656429864096911678noreply@blogger.com